ENTIRE TESTIMONY OF FELIX A. INSLERMAN
Annotated Version

Before the Permanent Subcommitteee on Investigations of the
Committee on Government Operations, United States Senate
February 19, 1954
Joseph R. McCarthy, Chairman
Roy M. Cohn, Counsel

The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Inslerman, I want to thank you very much. I know the course you are following today is difficult, extremely difficult for any man who has been involved in espionage, to come forward and tell the truth frankly. It takes a great deal of intestinal fortitude, a great deal of courage.

I would like to compliment the attorneys in this case for giving their client advice to be helpful to the country instead of hiding behind the Fifth Amendment. I want you to realize that it would be much easier for you just to come in here and invoke the Fifth Amendment. I think what you are doing this morning displays a great deal of courage.

Mr. COHN. Mr. Inslerman, may we first get your full name and the spelling?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Felix August Inslerman.

Mr. COHN. I-n-s-l-e-r-m-a-n?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. And where were you born, Mr. Inslerman?

Mr. INSLERMAN. New York City.

Mr. COHN. You were born in New York City where?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Around Third Avenue and 33rd Street.

Mr. COHN. What year?

Mr. INSLERMAN. 1910.

Mr. COHN. And where did you receive your education?

Mr. INSLERMAN. In New York City public schools; in New Jersey, the High School of New Jersey.

The CHAIRMAN. I wonder if the photographers would desist from taking flash pictures while the witness is testifying, if you don't mind.

Mr. INSLERMAN. High school in New Jersey; Cooper Union in New York; Polytechnic Institute of Brooklyn, N. Y.; and Johns Hopkins in Baltimore.

Mr. COHN. I might ask you this, Mr. Inslerman: You have been named, of course, by Whittaker Chambers as one involved in the Soviet apparatus, in that you photographed various documents [allegedly obtained from Alger Hiss and others by Whittaker Chambers]. You have been called in connection with that on prior occasions, and you invoked the Fifth Amendment. Is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

The CHAIRMAN. May I suggest, Counsel, it might be well to read into the record the description given by Whittaker Chambers in this case. I understand you talked to the witness last night and be confirms exactly what Mr. Chambers said some time ago.

Mr. COHN. There is substantial agreement on the entire matter.

The CHAIRMAN. Would it be well to read it into the record, do you think?

Mr. COHN. We will have that done.

The CHAIRMAN. All right.

Mr. COHN. Now, Mr. Inslerman, I understand that this morning you will not invoke the Fifth Amendment, but will tell the truth about your entire participation and knowledge; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. And, first of all, it is a fact that you were never a card-carrying member of the Communist Party; is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. But you were involved in the operations of this Soviet espionage ring, is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. Were you active, years ago, in something called the Estonia Workers Club?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And how would you describe the politics of that organization?

Mr. INSLERMAN. On the radical side.

Mr. COHN. On the radical side. Would you attend its meetings and participate in various of its activities?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. About what year was this, would you say?

Mr. INSLERMAN. In the early l930s.

Mr. COHN. Did you meet a man by the name of Mr. Strickholm, S-t-r-i-c-k-h-o-l-m, in connection with these activities?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Did there come a time when Mr. Strickholm arranged an introduction of you to some other man?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Would you tell us about when that was, and just exactly what happened?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Sometime in the late spring or early summer of 1934, a meeting was arranged at 4 Central Park, and there I met a man named Bill.

Mr. COHN. You knew Bill over a period of a couple of years, is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes, until mid-1935.

Mr. COHN. Until about mid-1935. Did you ever find out or were you ever told Bill's last name?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. You knew him only as "Bill," is that right?

Mr. INsLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. Was Bill an American citizen, as far as you knew?

Mr. INsLERMAN. I do not know.

Mr. COHN. Do you know what his nationality was?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I believe he may have been Estonian.

Mr. COHN. By the way, is this the same Bill whom you saw at a later date in Moscow?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Just exactly what transpired between you and Bill before you did go to Moscow? What was the nature of your relationship with him?

Mr. INSLERMAN. There were a number of meetings there, and at one time I obtained an apartment for him in New York City.

Mr. COHN. Do you know for what purpose he would have used that apartment?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. For what purpose? For what purpose would he have used that apartment, do you know?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, as I look back upon it now, it may have been a blind, and perhaps to photograph documents.

Mr. COHN. Did you do what you were instructed to do, insofar as obtaining this apartment was concerned?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And did you receive at any time any sums of money from Bill for doing what he asked you to do?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Was that money in cash or check?

Mr. INSLERMAN. In cash.

Mr. COHN. And during this time, you say you did not know Bill's last name?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I did not know Bill's last name.

Mr. COHN How would your meetings with him be arranged? How would you know where to meet him? Would the next one be arranged at the last one?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes, at the last meeting.

Mr. COHN. At one, you arranged for the next one?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. You had no way of contacting Bill directly?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I had no way of contacting him directly.

Mr. COHN. You didn't know who he was?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. Did there ever come a time when Bill requested that you make a trip to the Soviet Union?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Would you tell us about when that was, about what year?

Mr. INSLERMAN. In 1935, approximately a month before I actually sailed.

Mr. COHN. And before you did sail for the Soviet Union, did Bill introduce you to another man whom you came to know as a member of the Soviet apparatus?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN: And by what name did you know this other man?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Bob.

Mr. COHN. And who do you now believe Bob to be?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Whittaker Chambers.

Mr. COHN. What did Bill tell you about going to Russia? What was his suggestion? How did the thing come up and what did he say about it before you went? What arrangements were made?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, at the beginning it was supposed to be a visit of fairly short duration.

The CHAIRMAN. I wonder if you would try and speak a little louder, if you could.

Mr. COHN. You say at the beginning it was supposed to be a visit of short duration; is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. Were you supposed to go alone originally?

Mr. INSLERMAN. At first, my wife was supposed to go along with me.

Mr. COHN. Were those plans ever changed?

INSLERMAN. Yes.

COHN. By whom were they changed?

Mr. INSLERMAN. By Bill.

Mr. COHN. He told you you could not take her along?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. How did you obtain a passport and make the necessary traveling arrangements for the trip to the Soviet Union?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Actually, I got two passports. One passport was given to me and was later recalled by Bill. The second passport – I cannot recall whether I filled out an application blank for it or whether it was given to me.

Mr. COHN. When did Bill recall the first passport? Was that before you left for the Soviet Union?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Before I left, yes.

Mr. COHN. Do you know the reason he recalled that?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No, I do not.

Mr. COHN. In any event, you did get another passport either by applying for it or from Bill, and you used that?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. On about how many occasions did you meet Bob, or Whittaker Chambers, before you left for the Soviet Union? Do you recall that?

Mr. INSLERMAN. At least once, and perhaps twice.

Mr. COHN. How did you go to Russia?

Mr. INSLERMAN. By boat. I sailed from New York to London.

Mr. COHN. On what steamer?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I believe it was the U.S.S. Washington.

Mr. COHN. And how did you get from London to the Soviet Union?

Mr. INSLERMAN. On a Russian ship. Its name I don't remember.

Mr. COHN. Do you remember where you landed in the Soviet Union?

Mr. INSLERMAN. At Leningrad.

Mr. COHN. And did you stay at Leningrad or did you go on to some other city?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I don't know whether I stayed overnight there or traveled directly to Moscow.

Mr. COHN. I assume you proceeded to Moscow by train; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. By the way, who paid the expenses for the trip?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Bill.

Mr. COHN. Bill gave you the cash for the trip?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. When you got to Moscow, did you stay at a hotel?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr COHN. Had you been told before you left the United States, by Bill, at which hotel you were to register?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. By the way, were you traveling under your own name?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. Under what name were you traveling?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Under the name of Frank DeLac.

Mr. COHN. How do you spell the last name?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I think it is D-e-L-a-c.

Mr. COHN. And who had suggested that name to you?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That was on the passport.

Mr. COHN. That was the name on the passport which they gave you, is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And you adopted that name during this trip?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. After you were in Moscow, did you see Bill?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes, I saw Bill.

Mr. COHN. Do you know how he came from the United States to Moscow?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I do not.

Mr. COHN. He did not come with you, is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. After you made contact with Bill in Moscow, did he ever introduce you to anybody else there?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. To whom?

Mr. INSLERMAN. A young man.

Mr. COHN. And did you know his name?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I knew him by the first name. I don't recall his first name now.

Mr. COHN. You were never given a last name in that instance, either?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. Did this young man spend a good deal of time with you while you were in Moscow?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Did you receive from Bill, and this young man, directions as to what you were to do while in Moscow?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And what did they have you do in Moscow? Did they train you in some way or attempt to train you in some way?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, that is the first time I saw a Leica camera.

Mr. COHN. They took you to see a what?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is the first time I saw a Leica camera.

Mr. COHN. A Leica camera?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Did they train you or attempt to train you in its operation?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And did they attempt to train you in the operation of anything else?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I remember practicing code for some time.

Mr. COHN. Code?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Code, yes.

Mr. COHN. And anything besides a Leica camera and code?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No, that is all.

Mr. COHN. Where did you receive this instruction in the Leica camera and code?

Mr. INSLERMAN. It is in some building in Moscow.

Mr. COHN. Who took you to that building?

Mr. INSLERMAN. This young fellow.

Mr. COHN. Pardon me?

Mr. INSLERMAN. This young fellow.

Mr. COHN. During the period of time you were in Moscow, did you ever see Bill clothed in any dress other than civilian clothes?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I saw him once in a military uniform.

Mr. COHN. In military uniform?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. I assume, of course, in the United States you had never seen him in anything but civilian clothes; is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. About how long a period of time did you remain in the Soviet Union?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, I came back December of 1935, just prior to Christmas.

Mr. COHN. And while you had been in the Soviet Union, your training was primarily in the Leica camera and in the International Code; is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Before you left the Soviet Union, were any arrangements made for you to continue your contact with the Soviet apparatus when you returned to the United States?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Would you tell us who made those arrangements with you, and what you recall about those arrangements?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, I was to meet a man named Ben. Whether that name was his name at the time, I do not recall. But it was some prearranged plan.

Mr. COHN. And was that a plan for a specific meeting?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. For the first meeting? Was the place set?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Do you recall where that place was to be?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I believe it was the Paradise Theater in the Bronx.

Mr. COHN. The Paradise Theater in the Bronx, New York? Let me see if I understand this. In Moscow, before you left the Soviet Union, arrangements were made for this meeting, this rendezvous, between you and a man who was to identify himself as Ben, and which was to take place at some later time in front of the Paradise Theater in the Bronx; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. You say you returned to the United States prior to Christmas?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. And did you keep this meeting?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. With Ben in front of this movie theater in the Bronx?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And did Ben appear at this meeting?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. For a period of time thereafter, did Ben continue to be your contact man in this apparatus?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Did Ben continue to give you money as Bill had given it to you?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Did Ben ever give you any directions as to further training that you were supposed to have? Did he ever suggest you take any courses or anything along those lines?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I took some courses at the RCA Institute in New York, at his suggestion.

Mr. COHN. About how long did you attend the RCA Institute at his suggestion?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Just the spring of 1936.

Mr. COHN. After you had completed those courses, did your Soviet contact ever make any suggestions to you that you leave New York City and go elsewhere?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes. The early summer of 1936, a suggestion was made that I move to Baltimore.

Mr. COHN. Did you move to Baltimore?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I did.

Mr. COHN. By whom was the suggestion made?

Mr. INSLERMAN. By Ben.

Mr. COHN. Do you recall at what address you resided in Baltimore?

Mr. INSLERMAN. At 2113 Callow Avenue.

Mr. COHN. C-a-l-l-o-w?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. In addition to your contact, continuing your contact with the Soviet apparatus, did you obtain legitimate employment while you were in Baltimore?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes, finally, at the Bohn Refrigerator Co.

Mr. COHN. Sir?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Finally, at the Bohn Refrigerator Co.

Mr. COHN. B-o-h-n?

Mr. INSLERMAN. First at Westinghouse, in the spring of that year; and then Bohn Refrigerator Co. for approximately six months; and the Dakka Co. for approximately six months.

Mr. COHN. Is that D-a-k-k-a?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right. That brings me in to the year of 1938, then.

Mr. COHN. That was your legitimate employment, is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. During the period of time you were working for these companies, did you continue to be in contact with this Soviet apparatus?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. By whom were you contacted?

Mr. INSLERMAN. By Ben.

Mr. COHN. By Ben?

Mr. INSLERMAN. And at some time in Baltimore, again I don't know the exact date, but by Bob.

Mr. COHN. Did Bob, or Whittaker Chambers, ever give you anything when he contacted you in Baltimore?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. What did he give to you?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Some documents.

Mr. COHN. Prior to his giving these documents to you, had the apparatus supplied you with a camera?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes, in the summer of 1936.

Mr. COHN. What kind of a camera did they give you?

Mr. INSLERMAN. A Leica camera.

Mr. COHN. After they gave you that Leica camera, did there come a time when you obtained a second Leica camera?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes. I purchased my own Leica in the summer of 1937.

Mr. COHN. In the summer of 1937. Could you give us just a very brief description of the type of camera a Leica is?

Mr. INSLERMAN. It is a miniature camera. It takes pictures on 35-millimeter film.

Mr. COHN. Is it particularly suited to such things as photographing documents?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Do you recall the first occasion on which Chambers, or Bob, delivered to you any documents?

Mr. INSLERMAN. The recollection is dim, but sometime in late 1937, Chambers came to my house with some documents which I photographed.

Chambers had testified that the photographing of documents began much earlier. He also testified they met as a practice near Union Station, not in Inslerman's home.

Mr. COHN. Did Chambers give you documents to photograph on any occasions besides this once?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes. There were, as far as I can recall, five different occasions.

Chambers claimed it had been a weekly process that went on for nearly a year.

Mr. COHN. In other words, you can recall specifically five different occasions on which Chambers gave you these documents to photograph; is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Were these documents, from your observation, Government documents?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Do you recall anything about the content of any of these documents, any of the names you might have seen, whether they were State Department names or material, or things along those lines?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I recall the name of Grew.

Mr. COHN. Ambassador Grew?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Grew; yes. G-r-e-w. And Bullitt.

Mr. COHN. Ambassador Grew and Ambassador Bullitt. You recall specifically those two names on the documents. Is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. What instructions would Chambers give to you when he delivered these documents to you?

Mr. INSLERMAN. To photograph them, return them, and return the ifim.

Mr. COHN. By the way, of course, you never knew that Bob's name was Whittaker Chambers?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I did not.

Mr. COHN. You knew him as Bob – period – just as you had known the other members of the apparatus as Ben and Bill, and so on, and so forth?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. What instructions did Bob give you concerning these documents when he would give them to you?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, I was to photograph them and the following day return the documents back to him as well as the film.

Mr. COHN. Would Bob place a time limit? Would he give you a time limit within which you had to do this work, on occasion?

Mr. INSLERMAN. They usually had to be returned the following morning.

Mr. COHN. The documents usually had to be returned by the following morning?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

This is a significant point. Chambers specifically claimed that because Hiss secretly took the documents out of his his office, they had to be returned that same night.

Mr. COHN. Would you deliver these documents to Bob or would he come and pick them up, or what?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I delivered them to Bob.

Mr. COHN. You would deliver them to him. Where would you deliver them to him, do you recall?

Mr. INSLERMAN. In Washington, except on the first occasion, when he came to my home, he took the documents along with him, himself, at that time, as well as the film.

Mr. COHN. And would you see Bob in both Baltimore and in Washington?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. While you were continuing these contacts with Bob, and while he was giving you these Government documents to photograph, did you continue your contact with Ben?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Up in New York?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. About how frequently would you see Ben?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, my recollection is dim, but it seems that it would be around once a month.

Mr. COHN. Who would pay you for the work you did, Bob or Ben?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, I recall getting money from both Ben and Bob.

Mr. COHN. Did there ever come a time when Ben ceased to be your Soviet contact in New York?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And was he succeeded by anybody else?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes; by a man named Jake.

Mr. COHN. By a man named Jake?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And you never knew Jake by a last name, is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No, I did not.

Mr. COHN. Would you continue your meetings with Jake as you had with him in the past?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. For about how long a period of time did you continue, to your best recollection, photographing these documents for Chambers or for Bob?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, to the best of my recollection, it was sometime in either late spring or early summer of 1938.

Mr. COHN. Did there come a time when you were no longer contacted by Bob?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And did you learn thereafter that he had defected or broken from the Soviet underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Would you tell us the circumstances under which you learned that? I might ask you this. I will withdraw that and ask you this preliminary question: After Bob no longer contacted you, after he stopped contacting you, did you continue your contact with your Soviet representative in New York, Jake?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, you see, I can't remember exactly when Jake came into the picture and when Ben left off. But contacts were continued, I believe.

Mr. COHN. In other words, do you recall seeing Jake after you saw Bob for the last time?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Would you tell us the circumstances under which you learned that Bob had defected from the Soviet underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I went to Washington – it must have been because of a telephone call – and on a street corner I met someone – whom it was, I do not recall – and this man gave me a letter. Something was said at the time, and on the way home I opened the letter.

Mr. COHN. You opened the letter, is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I opened the letter, yes.

Mr. COHN. Did you read the letter?

Mr. INSLERMAN. I read the letter.

Mr. COHN. And from reading the letter, did you learn by whom that letter was written?

Mr. INSLERMAN. It was written by Bob.

Mr. COHN. And for whom was the letter written by Bob intended?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, to be forwarded.

Mr. COHN. To be forwarded to - ?

Mr. INSLERMAN. To either Jake or Ben.

Mr. COHN. To be forwarded to a member of the Soviet apparatus?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. From reading that letter, did you learn that Bob had broken sharply with the Soviet underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Can you describe for us the nature of that letter, just in general terms?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Well, my recollection, again, is dim. But it was a horrible letter. Death was mentioned there, and Bob was afraid of his life, and I imagine the life of his family.

Mr. COHN. That was the general nature of the letter, is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. I understand you copied part of that letter, is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Pardon?

The CHAIRMAN. Did you copy part of that letter?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. And after the committee issued a subpoena, I understand you went to the FBI, upon the advice of your lawyers, and you gave the FBI all the information that you could, and are still giving them information?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

The CHAIRMAN. And you gave the FBI the part of the letter which you had copied; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

The CHAIRMAN. And you have given the committee a copy of that part of the letter which you copied, also; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

The CHAIRMAN. I might suggest, Mr. Counsel, that this be read into the record at this time. This is a letter - and let us see if we have it straight - this is a letter from Bob, or Whittaker Chambers. It was delivered to you, to be in turn given to your contacts in the espionage apparatus. Before you turned that over to the underground, you copied it, and what we have today is part of the Whittaker Chambers letter directed to the underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

The CHAIRMAN. I might suggest that it be read into the record.

Mr. COHN. Very well, Mr. Chairman.

As you explained, this is merely a section of the letter, and some words at the beginning are illegible. A couple of words throughout the letter are illegible, and there are abbreviations.

The first line, to read everything here in the excerpt, the first line has the word ‘‘t-i-e," "tie''; then a little later, "f-i–e-d''; then a blank space; "a"; then "on"; "but if it is" - then some more words are skipped. There is a "T," then "is somebody else of the same breed, so that it does not make ––––– C. H. different."

Then from this point on, there is a full text of this section:

"Two months ago, such a warning might have alarmed me. At this moment I find it funny. U1 is racing with ug."

The CHAIRMAN. Does that mean the underground?

Mr. COHN. Well, it does have that abbreviation.

"I feel that if you can afford to take that risk, so can I, and that if you really must -- there is a "y" instead of a "t"

"continue violent projects against me or my family, you are certainly going to have competition. I do not say that you will fail, but what I believe is that you will involve yourself in a major disaster, the consequences of which you cannot even begin to appraise realistically since it is clear that you - the 'you' is omitted - do not appraise realistically even your own position here at present.

"No doubt the handling of the G-n case, especially the verbal parts and certain reports that have come to your recent attention, not only from the intelligence but from the foreign O - undoubtedly meaning 'Office' "lead you to believe that the ug, both from domestic and international reasons, dreads nothing so much as an exposure of your activities."

"As regards the Pres. and the Att. G." undoubtedly the President and Attorney General - "directly under the Pres., this may be true. But not every office (and this is a direct warning) of the Att. G. is in line with the Pres. policy: for more than one reason, some of them may be interested in initiating investigations of their own. One of them is engaged in such an investigation now.

"After all, even in nonpurge years, there is frequent jurisdictional conflict 'at. home'" - and that 'at home,' I think from the context, refers to the Soviet Union, Mr. Chairman - "not only between the Commis - but between departments within the same Commis.-" - undoubtedly meaning 'Commissariat' - "as my misfortunes of last year are in part a good example. It is no different in America. Do not imagine that F. Murphy is there wholly for the purpose of dampening all investigations or that the State Department can forever put the brakes on them. In fact, I should guess that the State Department is going to be sitting on some very hot coals in the near future. There is something brewing now, but from the calm way you are running around, you do not seem to know it."

That is the excerpt from the Chambers letter.

Now, after you copied this letter, and from which you have retained this excerpt throughout the years, did you pass the letter on to the Soviet underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes; I did.

Mr. COHN. To whom did you give that letter?

Mr. INSLERMAN. To Jake.

Mr. COHN. Did you ever discuss the contents of that letter and Chambers' defection from the underground with Jake?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Did you have satisfactory discussions with Jake about that?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. Did you press him on the complaints Chambers made in his letter about the treatment and the threats and the things along those lines?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Pardon me?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. And did Jake explain the position of the Soviet underground to your satisfaction?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. And did this rift eventually lead to your defection from the underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. About when would you say that that defection on your part occurred?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Again, my recollection is dim, but it was in late 1938 or early 1939.

Mr. COHN. And your defection occurred when you no longer received or accepted contact from Jake, who was your last Soviet underground representative; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. And from that time on, have you had any connection with the Soviet underground?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. Have you engaged in any further acts of espionage of any kind?

Mr. INSLERMAN. No.

Mr. COHN. When you were called before the grand jury in a proceeding in connection with the Alger Hiss trial, you invoked the Fifth Amendment; is that correct?

Mr. INSLERMAN. Yes.

Mr. COHN. Against self-incrimination?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is right.

Mr. COHN. However, when you were served with a subpena by this committee a short time ago, after consultation with your counsel you decided that the proper course to follow as an American citizen was to cooperate with the duly constituted authorities, and you therefore have told the truth to the FBI and to this committee; is that right?

Mr. INSLERMAN. That is correct.

Mr. COHN. I think that completes the examination.

The CHAIRMAN. I want to thank you very much, sir.

May I say to your counsel, as you know, there are many other things we would like to go into with this witness. However, his decision to testify has been so recent that I do not want him to cover anything unless he is absolutely positive of the facts. Some of the material we went over last night, as you may recall, was a bit vague. I would like to go into some of that other material at a later date, after he has had a chance to refresh his recollection.

I may say that I got in touch with Whittaker Chambers last night. He is ill at the present time. Otherwise, I would like very much to have this witness and Mr. Chambers get together, and together they perhaps can recollect many more facts than he can alone. I talked to Mrs. Chambers, and I am inclined to think that Whit will be perhaps available within a matter of weeks.

When that occurs, the committee would like very much if one of the attorneys and the witness could go over there and sit down with Whittaker Chambers. If you will do that, and get in touch with us, we will make the arrangements for you.

Mr. BRIGOS [Inslerman's attorney] . We wish to express our appreciation for the courtesies of the committee, too, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much.

Your next witness?

Mr. COHN. Mr. Chairman, before calling the next witness, in accordance with your suggestion I think we should again note on the record here that the confirmation given by Mr. Inslerman on the facts developed by the Federal Bureau of Investigation over the past years, is that there is once again further testimony of the magnificent job that that agency, under Mr. Hoover, has been performing in exposing Soviet espionage in this nation.

The CHAIRMAN. That is right.

Back to the grand jury